The vast majority of Walther PPs and PPKs were commercial and here's where it gets confusing. It was issued to the military as evidenced by the Waffen proofs. Walther Pp 22lr Serial Numbers Walther Ppk Serial Number Identification Tool. It has gotten very good reviews, too. So for example if serial number 795123 was the last number assigned, and an order for 3 PPK pistols was received, they would be assigned serial numbers 795124, 125 and 126. Now, in a previous video, I said, for those of you who are sharp, you'll remember this. You'll find the slide Waffen proof on the tang. We still have the brown grip. These changes were not all made at once, and included the following in no particular order: The long overhang tang frame was introduced, the chamber was left blue rather than bright, the safety lever and extractor were standard blue rather than the fire blue finish, and the full serial number now became standard on the right side of the slide. The PPK uses a shorter barrel, slide and magazine, had a one piece plastic wrap-around grip, and was designed for easier concealment. Crown over N stamp shows that the pistol was test fired using ammunition loaded with smokeless gunpowder. From this point in time both PP and PPK pistols were being assigned serial numbers intermixed in the same range up until almost number 999999, and it is generally not possible to tell by the serial number if a pistol is a PP or PPK Model. It also has the serial number on the slide, which is unique for this subcontract. In fact, this one is missing the proof marks, which means it was never issued. Great question, Tim! So, a lot of the officers who came from the usually the more upper-class people would often go out and buy their own guns. Only a handfull of those pistols were produced because the German army decided to go for the more advanced P38. The Serial Numbers of the pistol subject to this recall are as. You'll notice I don't have the boring pullover. So, for a period of time, they experimented with wooden grips. My dear vintage pistol collector friends, I am posting this information for John Pearson (longtime Walther and vintage WW II era pistol collector). I just want to just show you that by the end of the war 1945, they actually didn't even bother putting you see this slide legend. Up until this point in production, for most guns only the last three digits of the frame serial number of the pistol were scratched on the inside of the slide. The officers tend to have the smaller guns and they liked the PP and the PPK. Pistols are not my strong point, so I … 001xxx 9x19mm P38 5/57 Slide No 016xxxE 9x19mm P38 62 Frame Yes 165xxx 9x19mm P38 2/ … Diablo 2 patch windows 10 download. However, some of them did go to the military and it has a completely separate marking, which I'm going to show you in a minute. If you're going to shoot a lot, in not very long the 9 ends up being cheaper. Lloyd, Thank you very much for the information provided. The third variation is Waffen 3 5 9, but no matching magazine, so, therefore, it's still the high polished finish. PS-Bersa also makes a 'CC Thunder' with smoother exterior for true pocket carry, it is a diff animal and doesn't take same mags. My Grandfather gave my Father tonight a Walther PPK serial number 217167. How do I know the difference? Personally I am partial to the P-64 but the double stack of the CZ-82 is a nice bonus if you don't think it makes it too big. For the best experience on our site, be sure to turn on Javascript in your browser. Make sure you push the like button so I can wear it again. When the Model 2 was released in 1914, this pistol became known as the Model 1. Post War Walther Ppk Serial Numbers Rating: 4,3/5 5556 reviews. However, with a few exceptions.380s tend to be more pocket sized. Visit our website for new treasures daily. I might try the Hornady Critical Defense stuff though..380 ammo is kinda pricey for plinking and target shooting so be aware of costs. Walther PPK Serial Number Help Get the gun and give me a call if you want and tell me the markings on it. You'll see those on Walther products, such as the P-38 and other guns. It turns out that by this particular point in time apparently tens of thousands of orders had already been received at Walther for Model PP pistols, and numbers for these future PP pistols had been pre-assigned up to around 1072xxx. High polished finish comes in a specific Sierra range. Bid on Lot #1612: Nazi Walther PPK Party Leader Pistol - This is an excellent example of an all original Walther Mod. It was probably in 1941 that Walther made a number of changes to PP and PPK pistols. They just do. Crown over N stamp shows that the pistol was test fired using ammunition loaded with smokeless gunpowder. The Reichs Zeugmeisterei (RZM) served as the quartermasters office of the National Socialists (NSDAP) and later became the chief approving authority on many types of military weapons, clothing, textiles and some raw materials. As orders came into the factory they were assigned serial numbers, starting with the next one available in sequential order. Only you can say. Based upon these serial numbers, it is my assumption that PP number 998957 was also produced before the introduction of the suffix feature. Walther Ppk Serial Number Location On Mercury Outboards; Walther Ppk Serial Numbering; In 1910, Walther introduced the 'Deutche Selbstlade Pistole Walther' in 6.35mm. 8 - Wikipedia. A buddy and I both considered PPKs and passed on them - according to internet reports they tend to have poor reliability and slide bite. At this point in the discussion let me make the following observation about serial number assignments in the Walther Factory. The blue applied was probably the same, but since the metal parts were no longer given a high polish finish first, the milled finish blue looks quite different. I just don't think the.380 has the 'umph' to make a hollow point worth while. We'd love to record your serial numbers. If you have any questions you can reach me not on the internet but by telephone at (818) 769-3509, West Coast Time. Now it still has the slide legend. But rather the German army. In general, I seem to find 9 mm for about $10 per box, and.380 for more like $15. Serial A057xxx. Let's just compare it to the high polished finish. Are serial numbers .Walther P3. A very helpful & educational video for those who want to learn more about these historic WW2 weapons. We know that production of the PPK Model did not continue until the end of the War because there are no PPK pistols with the Walther “ac” code applied to the slide instead of the full legend markings. What is one worth? Every week we put items for sale starting at $1 ! For a nice fun gun I would buy a PP in the caliber it was designed for, 7.65 or 32 AVP and have fun shooting something you can have a lot of pride in. The article states that the last PPK was in the 431xxxk range. Third Variation serial number range 216305p-234705p (13,000 produced) Fourth Variation serial number range 235879p-368800p (66,000 produced) POLICE. Its the model that was made by the Ranger Company (??) This is also a Waffen  3 5 9. There is no suffix to the serial number. Serial Number Caliber Slide Legend Date Date Location Commercial (E/N)? [clarification needed] The smaller size made it more concealable than the original PP and hence better suited to plain-clothes or undercover work. You'll see that on all the Walther weapons, they'll have an eagle or a Waffen Eagle 3 5 9. It was a special contract. Its a very easy gun to take down and clean. And this goes along with our theme of Walthers, Walther PPs and PPKs, which are pre 1946. This is gonna throw you a curveball. I carry a PPK as my retirement CCW gun in.380. And they will bite you if you're not paying attention to your grip..380 in them is stout recoil, but it is a better defensive round. Edit to add: (Not my photo!) Their solution was to introduce an alpha suffix to be added to all of their different pistol model serial numbers. 8Type. Both are accurate enough for a CCW gun. Just look into it a little and learn that Walther may not have the illustrious history you think it does. Hey, guys, I have another educational video for you today. My dear vintage pistol collector friends, I am posting this information for John Pearson (longtime Walther and vintage WW II era pistol collector). We do find guns out of sequence, as for example with Eagle N proofed guns appearing before some higher numbered Crown N guns. Keep in mind that Walther had never intentionally produced two guns with the same serial number, and now they needed to create a new serial number range for the Model 8. The next big change was to eliminate the high polished finish on the guns and to instead use what we collectors have come to call a military or milled finish. HISTORIC FIREARM OF THE MONTH. Walther Pp 22lr Serial Numbers; Walther Ppk Serial Number Year Chart; Interarms Ppk Date Of Manufacture; Greetings.I have a Walther PP for sale, and I have a guy who wants to buy it, but he won't buy it unless I can prove that it is war time. Beautiful looking gun. We know, for example, that all serial numbers from 820xxx to 844xxx are PPK pistols with the RZM marked slide, but no one can say if a PPK in this range was produced before or after PP number 870xxx. I'm going do an educational video today. Over time this “spread” will even increase more. Importation was discontinued 1986, when all production resumed in Ulm, Germany. That's right, it has an A suffix. Post-war P38 in 7.65mm Parabellum. There might be a few mistakes made by the factory which resulted in applying duplicate numbers to guns, but most “duplicate” serial numbers are actually reporting errors by collectors or those who do the data base processing. I like the looks a balance of the PP better than the PPK. It has interarms Alexandria virgina on the slide This should answer the question. Please call us or email us to set up a time to stop by. So, what I've done is I put together a cheat-sheet which you can get from us by going go to our Website or just email us at the address below and ask us for this and we'll email this over to you. Finish: rough Military Finish, blued: Grips: one piece chequered Bakelit with Walther-banner, black: Serial number: 6-digits number with suffix "K" right on frame. The officers tend to have the smaller guns and they liked the PP and the PPK. They all have terrible double action triggers. For the best experience on our site, be sure to turn on Javascript in your browser. They chose the alpha suffix based upon the model of the pistol. If you want something for concealed carry / defense buy a.380 Beretta 84 bb. The PPK pistol was introduced into production in 1931/32, apparently starting with serial numbers around 757800. Thus when the PPK pistols were scheduled to start using the K suffix, the next pre-assigned number was around 10728xx. The information that I have presented in this article was formed over many years of research and is based upon lots of real world data. Now, let's talk about this second variation, which is also high polish. In 1984, Manurhin was imported directly with no Interarms logo or Walther trademark appearing on Models PP and PPK/S. Bond only for a little ha Have you fired the PP or PPK? What I am reading is the serial numbers started in the 750000. I said, if you ever see a numbered magazine, whether it's on the spine or the side or the bottom. It is very n... (read more) That means I'm very, very old. Rankin's book documents that the last PPK out of the factory was # 433521A. Box is intact except somewhere along the line the sticker with the serial number fell off. The first Police EF Model PP guns are found in the range of 354xxxP, and for the PPK they are first found in the range 423xxxK. In the German army, unlike the American army, it was not uncommon for an officer to buy their own pistol. The PPK pistol was introduced into production in 1931/32, apparently starting with serial numbers around 757800. E/359 left on slide: Test proof stamp: E/N right on chamber The number is 389337 P, and directly below it is the AC maker code. PPK. MILITARY ACCEPTED. Mod. I got a Bersa Thunder.380. This is known because none of these late War alloy frames have the long overhang tang feature. It has a reddish looking grip. At first these pistols were also marked PP on the slide, but in the 7579xx serial block they began to be marked on the slide with the new designation of PPK. Take a look at that. Based on my research, during the War the Walther Factory produced a percentage mix of roughly 60% PP pistols and 40% PPK pistols. So, what I'd like to do is take a look at what how do we know it's military issued, the one unique feature that you'll find is the Waffen proof. Made in Argentina, no doubt by escaped Nazis, so the quality is there. Semi- automatic pistol. For the PPK pistols this change was in effect by the 355xxxK range, and for the PP pistols this change was in effect by the 235xxxP range. Since you are documenting the FIRST one, allow me to document the LAST ppk. How do I know the difference? It is true that Walther did do some of their factory engraving on guns and then put them into storage without ever completing them, but I have seen no evidence that this “storage” concept was ever done for standard production guns. I do not believe that any of these “out of sequence” guns were completed and put on the shelf to later get the Eagle N proof. Post-war PP and PPK's manufactured at Ulm by Walther for commercial . Double action with decocker. I hope that all of this is understandable as you reread the above narrative. If you have questions, feel free to send them in. Buy How To Resolve Light Primer Strikes On Walther Ppk How To Resolve Light Primer Strikes On Walther Ppk Reviews : If you're looking for How To Resolve Light Primer Strikes On Walther Ppk . Walther's Patent Cal 7,65 m/m. Be careful on what you pay for one, often they will be represented as a WW2 era when its really just a police trade in. So, we know that this went to the Luftwaffe. So, the last variation 1945 would have a Waffen stamp here and here and as I said, I do have a 1945 PP. Following this French production, pistols were made in Germany and marked Walther, or made in France and marked Manurhin. Some PP's have a second serial number on the right.Consecutive serial number SVW-46s. Walther used serial numbers ranging from 1 to 10,000. Again, the cheat sheet will go over that for you. Acceptance stamp: E/359 left on frame. P3. But these went to the German army. For example, let us look at police marked guns, which changed over to the Eagle F (EF) marking late in the War. Obviously, German officers were somebody in Germany and they could go and buy their own pistol. Is it better then the PPK? 8Type. Also, we know they carried, The first variation is in Eagle 3 5 9, now 3 5 9 was the inspector approved for the Walther factory. Walther PP & PPK Date Charts 3/28/17: The missing charts are now restored. Thus PPK 795124 might not be built until after a large batch of PP pistols were built in the 801xxx serial block. Send me the serial number. He has included his telephone number if you want to visit with him or have input or a difference of opinion he would be happy to hear from you. I have fired a PPK, the hammer bit into my hand and after 2 mags i quit shooting it. This would have been about 1944. Nice better working more versatile version of PPK, if you are stuck on PPK look and feel. Great question, Tim! And therefore, mistakenly, a lot of people say, oh, this one went to the Nazi military. Extra mags a little expensive at around $33! I have studied the numerous variations of these guns and also analyzed large amounts of serial number data on them. This is the first variation. Was at Wal-Mart. We buy and sell collectible firearms and militaria ranging from the Civil War to Desert Storm, specializing in WW1 & WW2. . But, Walther did not build the guns in a strict serial number sequence; they built guns in a priority sequence. That's a commercial proof of firing proof. The ArmeePistole (army pistol) was the very first prototype/predecessor of the P38 and was already produced in 1935 by Walther in small quantities (highest serial number known is 55).This pistol had a concealed hammer and extractor. 6-digits number with suffix "K" right on slide. 'Manufacture of these Walther PP type pistols commenced in Mulhouse, France in 1951. Which round is better suited for self defense?.32 or.380? Am I missing something ? Of course newly assigned numbers from that point would no longer be in the million serial range. Most of the serial numbers also have a suffix letter. Sometime in 1938 Walther realized that they were going to have a problem with serial numbers, for their model 8 pistol (a smaller size 6,35 m/m semi-auto pocket pistol that had gone into production in around 1920) was now approaching serial number 750000 (the start of the PP pistol numbers). P3. There is no suffix to the serial number. 7 day inspection period on all website purchases. These changes first appeared for PPK pistols in the 33x,xxxK serial range, and for the PP pistols in the 22x,xxxP serial range. I am expanding my database. In the course of those conversations and exchanges many items related to Walther PP and PPK Wartime (WWII era) production procedures and expediencies arose so John decided to produce an article for the vintage collecting community, especially those interested in wartime Walther PP and PPK production relative to serial number sequencing and production priorities as it relates to these pistols. The gun is pictured in Rankins book. Walther Ppk S Serial Number; Walther Ppk 7 65 Serial Number Lookup By Name; The Mauser HSc is a 7.65mm pistol made in Nazi Germany during World War II and post-war. All in all a very nice example of a pre-gun control act of 1968 pistol. Either one of these books will contain an index of serial numbers for Walther guns. The serial number and Crown over N proof mark on the barrel is proper for 1938, I can not make out the marking under the ejecting port on the right side, it doesn't look like an military acceptance mark?. But when you go to the Luftwaffe bases, you'll find that there was a contract for nine-millimeter. This can again be explained by the fact that guns were being produced in priority sequence and thus serial numbered “out of order”. My PPK is a very reliable weapon. But I'd agree if you are open to other guns think Ruger 9mm and don't look back. I see no other marking that would make it anything other than a commercial model PPK. They were marked 'MANURHIN' on the slide until 1954. It goes over the Serial-Ranges, if you want to look that up, it will give you that information. One such gun reported is number 172837K, which is apparently one of the very first PPK pistols with the K suffix added. If you can swing it, a 9 mm is a better choice, mainly because the ammo is so much cheaper. Happy Holidays my collecting friends, Lloyd in Vegas WALTHER MODEL PP & PPK PRODUCTION INFORMATION My name is John Pearson and I have collected German semi-automatic pistols for almost 40 years, with one of my areas of special interest being Walther Model PP and PPK pistols. But this one is Waffen 3 5 9 proofed. All of them were test-fired, inspected and hit with an eagle N stamp. I believe, thanks to Mr. Pearson, the world of Walther pistol production and vintage Walther pistol collecting (PP and PPK) is perhaps a little less mysterious and perhaps we are a little more enlightened as a result. The firm started over at 1 when the number 10,000 was reached. They were imported into the USA by Interarms up to 1983. Now, this started out as an eagle 3 5 9 proof and then went to a Waffen 3 5 9 proof. The best and only way to ensure an item is yours is to purchase it directly off the site. Post-war P38 in 7.65mm Parabellum. All of this information means that during a given day on the Walther assembly line there could be Walther PP pistols that were 10,000 serial numbers apart, and that at the same time there could be a PPK pistol being manufactured that is 110,000 numbers higher. From this serial number data it is apparent that the P suffix was introduced before the Model PP pistols had reached the million serial block, but at that same time the PPK pistols were already being numbered in the million serial number block. This is a Luftwaffe marked holster with two matching mags. Thus for the model 8 it became an A (acht or eight in German), for their Model 9 it became an N (neun for nine in German), and for their Olympia pistols they used the letter O. He no longer is a member of NAPCA and is not on the internet so I told him I would be happy to post this great information for him. The serial numbers I have collected for these first P Suffix PP pistols are as follows: 997951P 997963P 998063P 97P 99013P 99025P 99210P 99239P 99428P 99453P 99705P 99930P Note that 999530 is a PPK and does not have a K suffix at this point, proving that it had already been produced before the P and K suffix concept was implemented within Walther. Walther PPK Stainless Interarms.380 This is my Walther PPK It is Stainless Steel version.380 cal This is an Interarms model Some made in the US some in Germany This one was made in 1990. We both love our Walthers, but in today's modern firearms world they are heavy in comparison to the plastic framed guns. So, this is a fourth variation. It is for this reason that many collectors believed that the suffix was introduced at the million serial number, but I have shown that it was not. Sort of like a cheaper Mil Spec 1911, in mini-version. Just like in the American factories, the inspectors would put their initials. I have another retired LEO friend who carries a Walther PP in.380. So, a lot of the officers who came from the usually the more upper-class people would often go out and buy their own guns. Here the slide legend is removed and if you look at the reverse, all they did was put the A.C. stamp, which was the factory code for Walther. Post-war PP and PPK's manufactured at Ulm by Walther for commercial sale carry the antler proof mark of the Ulm proof house. The Walther PP was chambered in .22, 6.35mm, 7.65mm, and 9mm kurz. But now we've moved to an Waffen Eagle 3 5 9, again, this is an inspector proof. Walther: The AP-serie. The third variation, we have the serial-range, but it is also a Luftwaffe contract. So yesterday I got an email from Tim. This would become the world’s most successful double action semi-automatic pistol, which at first was available only in caliber 7,65 m/m Browning (what we call the.32 automatic). Serial Number Caliber Slide Legend Date Date Location Commercial (E/N)? It wasn't later until later mid war to late war, they deteriorated the finish to adult finish. You had to know somebody or be somebody in order to get a gun.
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