These are the same size as a standard .38 Special, but run much hotter. Yet, the 9mm holds double the amount of pressure. The 9mm can be loaded with anything up to 147 grains. JavaScript is disabled. Shooters commonly choose a weight of around 125 grains for a lighter recoil. The 9mm Lugerhas become the popular caliber for US law enforcement agencies due to the availability of compact pistols with large magazine round capacity usi… For concealed carry, a snub-nosed revolver is ideal to stash away and go about your business. This is super simple to use, very accurate and can be carried easily. The standard 9mm NATO round is a 124-grain FMJ, loaded to 36,500 psi, which is a bit hotter than the CIP standard of about 34,000 psi. Those split seconds do count! extractor's and magazines will be your big problem..if you look inside a 9mm mag there is a spacer on the back inside of the mag..a 38 super has none..you can load 9mm in a 38 super as long as you make sure the bullets are all the way forward..just as easy to have 9mm and 38 super mags..the extractor is the key issue..also not that hard to swap out..if you put a 9mm next to a 38 super extractor you will see the difference..granted not a big difference but enough to make a difference..I was swapping Colt 9mm to 38 super back when people would say 38 what..just my 2 cents, I carry a .45 cause they don't make a .46. Since you load it with magazines, you can have a much greater capacity than with a revolver. The .380 ACP is known by other names such as the .380 Auto, 9x17mm, 9mm short, and 9mm Browning to name a few. He loves writing and sharing his extensive knowledge of firearms, especially AR rifles and tactical equipment. Like the 9mm, it was designed off another cartridge, the .38 ACP. 9mm Luger, which we’ll refer to as 9mm for the duration of this article, was introduced in 1902, and is essentially a .30 Luger cartridge that was necked up to accept a .355 diameter bullet. We mentioned that revolvers can be more reliable due to less moving parts and that they don’t rely on recoil. If it’s not a Kimber, it’s a copy. Pick what’s best for you and get comfortable with … Most of the powder isn’t used efficiently, and so the .38 Special bullet needed more powder to propel it. Thus, 9mm NATO is an overpressure variant. These bore sizes can vary with manufacturer and who's running the boring machine on a given day. The 9mm and 380, although they have the same diameter bullet, could not be used interchangeably. Truth is, 92% of statistics are made up on the spot. There are a lot of guns out there with interchangeable 9mm P and.38 Super barrels. You can most likely use a shorter ejector if using 9mm mags with the ramp up front and no spacer. Or whether you want to go for the reliability factor or the capacity one. Of course, there may be other arguments that strengthen the .38 Special’s corner. I think the.38 is outclassed on a broader scale by the 9mm, but it will never really be replaced in self-defense guns. Tons of guns on the market. I have several 1911 9mm guns, and the 10 round 9mm Wilson ETM mags work fine and are extremely reliable. I was just worried that high pressure +P+ 9mm would be harsh to the barrel and link as I was lead to believe that standard .38 super had similar performance with less strain on the link.... Hardly anyone is using .38 Super for competition, anymore. The only issue is that it is 7.24 inches, making it nearly an inch longer than the Smith & Wesson 642 .38. I've had that problem loading 115 grain bullets. However, while the .38 Auto was originally loaded to a pressure of about 23,000 c.u.p., the .38 Super Auto (which replaced it in 1929) was loaded to a pressure of around 33,000 c.u.p.—some 44 percent higher. A 38 Super mag will probably work but reliability may be an issue. The answer is yes! Although, more power in a projectile isn’t the only factor to consider for taking out a target. And, due to the obvious benefits, it was then used in the .38 Special. Posted: 3/25/2010 3:51:42 PM EDT Quoted: XD .40 and 9mm mags are interchangeable! Heavy bullets in a 380 can bulge the case when seated too deep. Thank you all for input. The .38 Special has been improved with the addition of the .38+P and .38 +P+. However, load selection in the latter is crucial. But, since the .38 Special has a larger casing, it can load up to a 158-grain level. 9mm mags typically have a small spacer welded on the inside of the back panel to keep the rounds forward for positive feeding. Not sure about any division shoot just local range competitions. Keep in mind that 38 Super is a longer cartridge than 9mm. But what use is that unless you intend to hunt larger game such as deer? For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. A .38 Special can be 11 grains heavier than the 9mm caliber, which adds a new dynamic to this debate. Although some foreign police use the .380 as a primary weapon, American police and military forces see it as a backup weapon, as it lacks the power of similar-sized pistols like the 9mm and .38 Special. 9mm does not fit in a 380 mag, but 380 fits nicely in a 9 mm clip. No, they are two different cartridges. So the 9mm does have a strong advantage in terms of speed of loading and capacity. .38,.357,.380 auto and 9mm ammunition are all the same caliber 9mm ammo in Rockville in 2007. Yeah, well i can shoot .38 special in my .357 magnum revolver!. If you're not shooting, moving, or reloading, you should be taping or picking brass. You do not need specific separate slides for 9mm P and.38 Super, head diameters are quite close and one breechface width will serve both. And, if you’re wondering why choose a revolver for self-defense? Yet, the 9mm holds double the amount of pressure. The 9mm and 9mm Luger are absolutely one and the same cartridge. But, of course, this all begs another important question. This is a choice that’s personal to everyone, we think. The .380 ACP is not to be confused with the .38 ACP 9mm Makarov, 9mm Parabelleum, or the 9mm Ultra. NOTE D: All 38 Special cartridges can be used in 357 Magnum revolvers but not conversely. Yet it is recommended to get the expanding variety of bullets for this. On post #8 a slight curve has been pitched into the discussion. Its primary use remains that of self defense for civilians, as its small size allows for easy concealment and it can hold a relatively high amount of rounds. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Sure one can assume that because something is larger it must be superior. Some of the newer mags have a little feed ramp on the lips for better feeding. When you think that the US military has adopted Sig Sauer pistols, and there’s the go-to Glock pistol family. Any gun chambered in .357 Mag can handle them all with ease. The clear enough answer is that they are generally more reliable than semi-auto pistols. A good example of this is the Glock 19 Gen 4 9mm Pistol. Why did George Luger choose smokeless powder? Thus, one weapon will fire .38 Special and .357 Magnum ammunition in one cylinder and 9-mm Luger in another interchangeable cylinder. Also, Ruger offers some amazing deals on quality firearms with true value for money. The thing is, .38 Specials are almost exclusively used in revolvers, as well as some lever-action rifles. Come join the discussion about optics, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! I've brought this topic up on other forms and the answer of just buy two pistols is getting old and now I'm asking for clear answer. Another weapon fires .45 ACP in one cylinder and .45 Colt in a second. Some 1911 9mm guns work fine with standard 10 round .38 super mags loaded with 9mm rounds. The feed ramp should not be an issue with that combination. It is slower burning, and less effective because of the impurities in its making. The bullet diameter is virtually identical as the 9mm Luger, with slight differences in neck diameter, rim diameter, and more. .38 or .357 mag slugs are .354 up to .356 inches in diameter so the slugs are interchangeable. Let’s take a look at their distinct features and how they compare against each other. The only reliable statistics are those that have been proven and recorded. I sold off my Colt and Caspian convertibles because I so seldom shot .38 Super. You might have to have dedicated magazines, you might not. 9mm can safely fire 9mm, 9x19, 9mm para, 9mm luger, 9mm nato. Just having multiple slides would be very convenient for range use. Another very strong benefit of a 9mm pistol is how easily the mag can be adjusted, instead of loading a revolver wheel. Generally speaking, a heavier projectile has more piercing capabilities, with the velocity being less of a factor here. We’ll even go as far as trying to announce the best of the two – or at least our personal favorite. And, the .38 Special has a trick up its sleeve…. 9mm is a semi-automatic cartridge and .38 caliber is a revolver cartridge. So ultimately, the 9mm is the most powerful of the two if they are loaded with the same weight. 9mm is certainly more powerful than .380 ACP, but that doesn’t mean that 380 isn’t powerful enough, especially if you can shoot better with a .380. Luger), and .380 (aka 9mm. A 9 MM is .354 inches. Performance And this double action only revolver is only 6.3 inches full length. I was aware of the different magazines and have no problem buy round specific ones for reliability. Notice the problem? A prototype straight-walled cartridge was made from .38 Super Lapua cases, which are rimless versions of the .38 Super. But do you need that penetration for self-defense in a handgun? 9mm vs. 38 special . On the other hand light weight bullets in 9mm or 38 Super can be too short and not feed properly. The more common name for the “9×23 SR” is the .38 ACP, so remember that the .38 ACP and .380 ACP are not the same cartridges. Good for small game hunting. For example, the Smith & Wesson 642 .38 is a great choice for concealed carry. If you decide on a pistol, then you’re more likely going to have a longer barrel than a snub nose revolver. (James M. Thresher/The Washington Post) So you’ll have a wide selection of guns to choose from. It is an easy mod if you know how. Whatever you feel comfortable and safest carrying should be your preference. Dirty & unreliable ammo. A year after the .38 Special’s release, smokeless powder was introduced. Smith & Wesson released the .40 S&W in 1990. If you can carry it, why not? I foresee this debate to be continued. However, the 9mm’s case is approximately ⅜ inches shorter than the.38 Special. But what else do they have in common and what sets them apart? .38 super mags just aren't quite as reliable in my guns. Posted: 3/25/2010 3:50:13 PM EDT XD .40 and 9mm mags are interchangeable! The .38 Long Colt, a standard military issue revolver cartridge adopted by the US Army back in 1892, was being used in the Philippine American War. And, both of them use smokeless powder. Norman is very proud of his service, and the time he spent in the Marine Corps and does not dwell on his injuries or anything negative in his life. The 9mm shell would be too long to fit into the 380 clip and the 380 shell would also not fit properly in the 9mm clip because it is too short. this is the most prolific handgun caliber in the world. cylinder and a 9 MM cylinder. NOTE: This answer assumes you meant the .357 Magnum revolver round, which is much better known than the .357 SIG auto round. Popular weights range from around 115 to 147 Grains for the round. Furthermore, they both house almost identical diameter bullets, with nearly the same piercing capabilities. In saying that, a great example of a decent mid-range to budget pistol that conceals very well is the Ruger Security-9 Compact. Parabellum (aka 9mm. Magazines are going to be the critical thing to make sure that both calibers run 100% It's very possible to fit 2 slides / barrels to one receiver. The Brass of each cartridge is a different length. They didn't have to cut the breech face - only fitted a new 38 Super ramped barrel and slightly shortened the ejector. 9mm. Didn't take much. Even when you load up the 9mm with the lightest weight possible, you still get past the 12 inch FBI penetration requirements, if you use controlled expansion type bullets. All these are exactly the same in diameter, yet they are quite different in their characteristics, and not interchangeable except that a .38 Special cartridge will fire in a .357 Magnum but not vice versa. A revolver might just have that edge on reliable functionality, but it can’t beat a good 9mm semi-automatic pistol. Georg Luger designed the 9mm in 1901, releasing it to the market about a year later. Also, why would you choose a .38 Special revolver when there’s the obvious choice of the super powerful .357 Magnum rounds. Well, according to FBI penetration standards, a handgun’s bullet must consistently penetrate ballistics gelatin at an average of at least 12 inches to a maximum of 18 inches. So thanks for checking us out on this 9mm vs .38 Special debate. Colt and Caspian slides seem to be fine with either round. (SAAMI standards are 35,000 psi.) Cons: Anemic. So with both the 9mm and .38 Special calibers comfortably being able to do this, surely the 9mm has the edge in the self-defense realm? If you’re interested in finding out, even more, check out our informative article on Bullet Sizes Calibers and Types, our Rimfire vs Centerfire comparison, and our Handgun Caliber Guide. So as I read it seems that I need different extractor for both. 9x23mm SR. And, with more powder needed, a longer case length had to be made. The .357 bullet has a small fringe at the base to keep it from sliding through the cylinder. And even if you run out of ammo, you have the potential to very quickly load in a spare mag too. Once I opened them to accept the 38S, they were fine. For this reason, the two are not interchangeable. If the slide is a true 9mm you can't run the Super since the breechface cut is too narrow for the Super rim. As a general rule, no ammo is "interchangeable" with other ammo. So, 9mm is cheaper, tends to work better in self-defense applications and you can carry more bullets. We’ve learned that these cartridges were made at the turn of the 20th century. If you're not shooting you should be moving. This is because they do not require recoil to function. NOTE C: Not for use in revolvers chambered for 32 S. & W. or 32 S. & W. Long. It can be referred to as the “9mm Parabellum”. And so far, it really comes down to personal preferences and what you want in a handgun, as both rounds will perform well in self-defense scenarios. Plus, it’s over seven ounces heavier too. Would doing this void warranty and if it did anyone know if Springfield would be willing to do this and preserve warranty? I was just worried that high pressure +P+ 9mm would be harsh to the barrel and link as I was lead to believe that standard .38 super had similar performance with less strain on the link. (there are a few others that are very obscure). The average weight of these rounds tends to vary between 110 to 158 grains. A great number of you reading this might be considering a conceal and carry weapon. They can both be considered older cartridge designs and were both designed primarily for use in handguns. They are all the same diameter, but might not work depending on what gun you are shooting them out of. He, unfortunately, received injuries to his body while serving, that included cracked vertebrae and injuries to both his knees and his shoulder, resulting in several surgeries. True. One major deciding factor is what type of gun do you prefer? Best of luck with your project. The .38 Special is one of the most common calibers used in revolvers. The .38 special can be fired in a .357, but a .357 is too long to fit in a .38 special. Worth a call to Springfield to check. the .38 brass will fit inside a .357 but not the other way around. The .38 Super ret… August 13, 2012 380 VS 9mm: Comparison. So ultimately, the 9mm can pack way more of a punch than the .38 in the self-defense realm. There has been a general trend away from .38 to 9mm because the latter allows pistols that can hold more rounds than a revolver, offers higher power, and is now the standard NATO pistol round. You can get a Wilson Combat dual caliber that has a spare barrel and recoil spring and magazines. But that doesn’t mean the .38 Special is inadequate by any means. First time anyone on a forum has said that the ramped barrels will be close enough to change without cutting the frame and that a new slide isn't necessary. A 124-grain 9mm NATO round zips along at about 1200 fps and just shy of 400 ft … After looking at all the factors and weighing things up, we’d definitely go with the 9mm Luger as our favorite caliber out of the two. So if you consider the ballistics values when both rounds are holding the same amount of weight, it’s not surprising that you’re going to … A factor that can make a projectile more effective is a heavier weight. We’ve looked at a range of factors concerning both the 9mm and .38 Special. In fact, it’s actually considered as an explosive. It’s a potent enough round for self-defense, and we would rather opt for a .357 Magnum round if a revolver was on the cards. If the .38 Special was a low-velocity round compared to the 9mm, this would be a problem. And, if you’re on a budget and set on a revolver, the .38 Special is a no brainer, as there are some fantastic options on the table. Real post: Thats pretty cool, too bad it most likely doesnt bring the mag cost down. Norman is a US Marine Corps veteran as well as being an SSI Assistant Instructor. Can’t be sure, though; details are important. Not sure about any division shoot just local range competitions. 9mm is known for more reliable expansion when using jacketed hollow points, though you can get .38 Special loads that will also do so. However, the 9mm’s case is approximately ⅜ inches shorter than the .38 Special. Due to the high pressures that smokeless powder generates, the 9mm casing was also developed to be stronger than the .38 Special round’s, with a more enhanced webbing structure to keep the whole thing stable. Corto or Kurz). Use only in firearms designated for this cartridge and so recommended by the gun manufacturer. Plus, there are plenty of extremely lightweight subcompact 9mm pistols currently on the market. I do use caliber specific mags. Going by the measurements you can run the 9 on a Super slide. Among handgun cartridges, for instance, the .38 Auto (or .38 ACP) and .38 Super Auto are the exact same length, and have the same diameter at the mouth, head and rim. The intention behind the .40 design was to take a parent of the FBI’s 10mm load, shorten the case and enable a larger round in existing 9mm designs without having to make significant modifications to the frame. It is strange how myth and legend can somehow evolve into fact. However, unlike the 9mm, this round was developed to use black powder rather than smokeless powder. - Z.C. It has a lightweight and snag-free design, which has to be one of the most popular on the market. Plus, you’ll be able to choose some excellent pistol designs that could help you react better in a self-defense scenario. And, this is mainly due to the type of guns that chamber it. So if you consider the ballistics values when both rounds are holding the same amount of weight, it’s not surprising that you’re going to see some higher values for the 9mm. Those guns were built in the 80s. Ruger manufactures a line of single-shot revolvers that have interchangeable cylinders. The heavier bullet has the potential to be more potent at causing damage to a target. Take a close look at these pictures of the ammunition. Springfield Armory did my conversion in the last few years (less than 5 years). To start with, let’s mention that it has to be the most commonly used round in the world. Legendary gunmaker, George Luger, introduced the 9mm round after the .38 Special, way back in 1902. The modern production 1911 - high visibility sights, beavertail grip safety, aluminum trigger, good trigger pull, enhanced slide/ frame fit, accurized barrel/bushing fit. Pros: Cheap! So you’ll be able to stash it away in your choice of holster. There’s only that extra grain to consider that the .38 Special can take on, which can cause more potent penetration on a target. it cannot shoot the 9x17, 9mm kurz, 9mm short or .380 (there are others too) However, it does keep up with the 9mm to a reasonable extent. As I am a resident of the wonderful Golden state our roster is keeping those unsafe guns away from us so having slides and magazines to have multiple calibers in one pistol is nice. I want a 9mm 1911 for range use but I would also like a .38 super if I ever try to compete. So kit guns aside, there are way more options to choose from in 9mm caliber form. In point of fact, the bore diameters are practically interchangeable. The idea behind the cartridge was to use a very powerful yet more volatile, high-pressure, and smoke-free powder. So let’s explore this topic some more in our 9mm vs .38 Special comparison…. In the end, this is just our preference and opinion on which is the better round. Building a functional multi cal gun falls well within that skill set. The .38 Special rounds can be fired from revolvers chambered for .357 Magnum or the .38 Long Colt as only the case length of .38 Special is different. At least my slide won't allow a 38 Super case to slide up breech face. And, for a number of reasons, you might not have considered. And, an excellent feature is that you can even get these with 15 plus one round capacity! If absolute power is what you want, why would you buy .38 Special when the same gun you can chamber the .357 rounds? Going by the measurements you can run the 9 on a Super slide. (Somehow the barrel knows which bullets you are using.) If the slide is a true 9mm you can't run the Super since the breechface cut is too narrow for the Super rim. Well, we argue that the .38 Special is still a super relevant caliber today.
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